Philip Blumel: Victory in South Carolina. Boom. And Governor Ron DeSantis hits the road for US Term Limits. Hi, I’m Philip Blumel. Welcome to No Uncertain Terms, the official podcast of the Term Limits Movement. This is episode number 263, published on May 19, 2025.
Stacey Selleck: Your sanctuary from partisan politics.
Philip Blumel: What a week. First, on May 7th, the South Carolina State Senate passed HCR 3008, the resolution calling for an Article 5 amendment proposing convention limited to the subject of term limits on Congress. The resolution passed by a vote of 29 yeas and 14 nays, as the resolution has already passed the South Carolina House. South Carolina is now officially the 12th State to approve the Term Limits Convention Resolution. Yes, 12 States, six of them in the last 18 months. Think about that. The momentum is really building. The biggest objection that we get at US Term Limits is not that term limits aren’t a great idea, it’s that it can’t be done. Well, it’s being done. It’s time for skeptics to get on board. Special thanks to leaders Senator Rex Rice and Representative Cal Forrest, also the South Carolina State Chair for US Term Limits, John Warren, and of course the whole USTL team, including Southern Regional Director Shanna Chamblee. Great work. So South Carolina is the third State to approve the resolution in just 2025. The resolution passed three States in 2024 as well, making 2024 our most successful year up to that point. But 2025 isn’t over yet and we expect this year to beat last year’s record.
Philip Blumel: According to the US Constitution, 34 States are required to mandate this convention. But history of Article 5 movements suggest that Congress will see the writing on the wall before that magic number is reached and pass an amendment itself. We’ll see. That’ll only happen if the pressure keeps building. So where next? We have passed the Georgia Senate and also the Arizona House this year so far, but these States won’t enter the win column until their respective chambers act. We need a win in the Georgia House. We need a win in the Arizona Senate. Now we expect a vote in Arizona near the end of the month. In Georgia, which has a two year legislative session, we don’t expect to get a vote until next year. The big action this last week was in Ohio, where some political star power put congressional term limits in the headlines and on the legislators agendas. Get this, Governor Ron DeSantis, who successfully led his legislature in passing the resolution, made a special trip to Columbus on May 13th under the auspices of US Term Limits to persuade Ohio lawmakers to get on board. In this audio clip Governor DeSantis is introduced by Ohio Representative Heidi Workman, the sponsor of the Term Limits Convention Resolution in the State. Take it away, Heidi.
Rep. Heidi Workman: I have to thank the Governor for being here with us today. I am very grateful also for the Speaker’s support in this process as we introduce House Joint Resolution 3. So about two weeks ago I introduced this resolution in committee and we are to this day receiving quite a bit of momentum on this, both in Ohio and nationwide. We have teamed up with the US Term Limits Organization who operates on the national level, and they have helped with really creating some momentum among our grassroots and getting the word out. This resolution is moving in Ohio. I am proud to discuss House Joint Resolution 3, a resolution recently introduced calling for congressional term limits. This is not a partisan issue. It is a people issue. Across Ohio and across the country, the demand for congressional term limits is strong and bipartisan. According to a recent survey, 78% of Ohio voters support term limits and 77% support Ohio taking direct action to make it happen. Voters are tired of Washington politicians spending decades in office, disconnected from the people they are represented or they’re elected to serve. They want change and they’re looking for that change right now.
Rep. Heidi Workman: Let me take a moment to thank the two leaders. I already have done that. Governor DeSantis, Speaker Matt Huffman. Both have been instrumental in the movement of this resolution here in Ohio and it is a pleasure to stand with them here today. HJR3 is a formal call from the State of Ohio urging Congress to propose an amendment to the US Constitution imposing term limits on its own members. This this resolution is part of a larger growing movement among States to demand action. This message is simple. The States are watching and we look for Congress to act. I wanna take a moment to explain how Article 5 works in the US Constitution. A joint resolution like HJR3 is a formal statement of the General Assembly.
Rep. Heidi Workman: It does not require the governor’s signature, but it goes through the same legislative process, committee hearings, floor votes in both chambers, and caucus discussions to gain the support needed to pass. Throughout this process, I’ve had the chance to engage in meaningful conversations with colleagues on both sides of the aisle. Many have shared stories from their districts where constituents are voicing frustration with the gridlock and entrenched interests in Washington. These conversations have reinforced what we already know. The people are ahead of politicians on this issue. They see term limits not as a partisan agenda, but as a common sense reform that will restore trust and opportunity in our federal government. I’m going to jump forward here and introduce to you Governor Ron DeSantis. I am sure you’re looking forward to his thoughts on this movement.
Gov. Ron DeSantis: Well, thanks so much. It’s Ohio and Florida, a very interesting relationship because we obviously have been a landing spot for people from a lot of different States. If you’re down in Boca Raton, it’s kind of like the Sixth Borough of New York, right? But you take a map of Florida, you can throw a dart and hit anywhere on that map, and you will find people from Ohio. I mean, Southern Florida, Central Florida, Northeast Florida, you name it, they’re there. And I think I’m proof of that. My mom is from Youngstown. My dad went to Youngstown State after growing up in Western Pennsylvania. And my wife grew up in Troy, Ohio, and both of her parents are Ohio State Buckeye graduates. And I do extend my congratulations for the national championship victory. There was a time when the national championship really went through the State of Florida. It’s been a while since any of our schools have been at that level. We think we may see something out of the Florida Gators this year. We had high hopes for the Seminoles a couple of years ago, so we’ll see what happens. But we do have a lot of similarities, including on political and governance.
Gov. Ron DeSantis: And this Term Limits Movement is something I’ve been a part of for a number of years. I served three terms in the US House of Representatives prior to becoming governor. I always remind people that I’ve recovered from that experience. But that experience did leave a mark about how Washington works and how the incentives to do really good policy are just skewed away from that. People get up there and basically they’re told, you got to pay your dues, you got to stay there, and the seniority and the longevity. And people want that to be their career. We have members that have been there for 30, 40 years, including people like Nancy Pelosi. That is not, I think, how the founding fathers envisioned this. I thought they thought at the time, you know, you’re gonna get on horseback from somewhere in Virginia and go up to New York, which is where the Capitol was originally, or go to Philadelphia, eventually Washington DC That’s not something you’re gonna wanna be doing for 30 years. And so they talked about the need for term limits and decided eh, you probably don’t need it. But I think that the incentives have really changed now.
Gov. Ron DeSantis: Even though Congress is almost universally disapproved of by the public, year after year, 95, 98% of incumbents are reelected. It’s not enough to say, well, people can just vote people out because the incumbents have skewed the system in financing and campaign regulations to be able to make it difficult to dislodge them. But this Article 5 convention from the States is something that Florida has certified. We now have more and more States up to 12. And this really just started a few years ago in earnest, Ohio is the naturally the next State to take this on and do. And I think it would be important to advance the movement of term limits. But I also think just Ohio being an important State politically in the history of our country, but certainly right now in modern and with the modern Republican Party being one of the strongest Republican States now that has a large population, I think symbolically would be really, really important. You look at the national debt, you look at the lack of productivity in Congress. I’m also a supporter. Full disclosure of the Balanced Budget Resolution that Ohio has passed, Florida has passed.
Gov. Ron DeSantis: I think we’re now up to 27, 28 States. I think you’re gonna end up seeing that get into the 30s very soon. I think the incentives for them to basically bankrupt the country are strong. If you had a balanced budget amendment, it would change the incentives. If you had term limits, it will change the incentives. You know, you have a limited amount of time, so make something of it. Do some big things that are actually gonna leave a legacy that you can look back on. And I also think it’s important that you serve in the House, you serve in the Senate. That’s great, and do that. But at some point, you ought to live under the laws that you passed and see whether that was good work or not. And what happens in modern Congress, once they get into that, they kind of become part of a separate political class that’s not really ever back in normal society in many instances, because even when people serve 20, 30 years, a lot of times they just stay in Washington after that. So this is a very positive reform. I think if the founding fathers were here today, people like James Madison would support term limits.
Gov. Ron DeSantis: Giving all the changes that have happened over these many, many decades, and I have never seen an issue. And Representative Workman hit it right on the head, it’s not a partisan issue. Republican, Democrat, rich, poor, male, female, black, white, it doesn’t matter. People support term limits. You ought to do the right thing for the right reason. But this happens to also be very good politics for the members of the Ohio legislature to sign up for, because people are gonna wanna see this as something that is getting legs, and it will get legs. And if Ohio comes, that’s gonna lead to many more States, I think, pretty shortly doing it. And as you build, you really, really have strong amend… Now people say, well, you’ve never done a convention of the States. Could you have a runaway convention and just have them write an entirely new Constitution? The answer to that is basically no. There’s two ways to propose amendments. The Congress can propose it with two thirds of each body, or the States can propose it with two thirds of the States, which would be 34 States. So you can do that. Ratifying it is the same no matter if Congress or the State proposes it.
Gov. Ron DeSantis: It requires three quarters of the States of this country, 38 States, to ratify an amendment to the Constitution. I don’t think 38 States are gonna ratify the work of a “runaway convention”. But even if you’re concerned about that, there’s nothing preventing Ohio, if they certify this for putting restrictions on what the delegates are allowed to do. You can have the governor recall delegates that are straying from that. I don’t think it would come to that. I really don’t. Term limits is popular. It could absolutely get three quarters of the States to be ratified. You know, really crazy changes like people have talked about, oh, they could go after the second amendment. They could… None of that is gonna have any chance to get ratified. So I don’t think it’s an appropriate concern. And I also think if that’s a concern you had, you’re basically saying that the founding fathers got it wrong. I think the founding fathers got it right. I think they knew that constitutions periodically needed to be amended. Not something you should do lightly. It’s not something you should do every year. But sometimes they needed that.
Gov. Ron DeSantis: And if you lodged it only in Congress, if Congress was the problem, then the people would have no recourse to make the changes that are necessary. So the States created the federal government, not the other way around. It was only natural that the States would also be able to propose amendments to the Constitution, understanding that no matter who proposes it, the States or the Congress, three quarters of the States must ratify any changes to the Constitution. So I commend the Speaker, I commend the representatives here at Ohio for doing this. This is kind of a passion project of mine. I’ve been involved in this issue for a number of years. I’ve rarely seen an issue that, no matter what audience I’m speaking in front of, will get a more positive response in any part of the State of Florida or, heck, any place I’ve been in the country where this has come up. People know that this is the right thing to do. So I look forward to seeing progress here. If there’s anything we can do to help in other States, I’m willing to do it because I do think it’s important for the future of the country. With that, we’ll take some questions.
Rep. Heidi Workman: All right.
Philip Blumel: Thank you, Governor DeSantis. Inevitably, the governor was asked during this trip if this was a campaign stop on a new presidential campaign, but Governor DeSantis said this has nothing to do with running for anything. I’ve been involved with term limits for 15 years now. Now I wanna back him up on that. As a member of the US House of Representatives, DeSantis was a US Term Limits pledge signer and the chief sponsor of the US Term Limits Constitutional Amendment Bill in the House, and as governor of Florida, he helped get term limits passed on school boards. He passed an updated version of the Term Limits Convention Resolution to clean up its language as Florida was the first State to pass it, you may recall, and the original bill wasn’t perfect. More recently, he’s been helpful in efforts to term limit all of the county commissions throughout the State. Many counties don’t have access to the initiative process to be able to do it themselves. I don’t know the governor well enough to offer insight on his presidential aspirations, but I can tell you for a fact that Governor Ron DeSantis is a member of the term limits movement in good standing and has long been so.
Philip Blumel: I should also note that US Term Limits has a new State Chair in Ohio. Former State Representative and State Senator Kevin Coughlin stepped into that role in January. He has some pretty big shoes to fill. The last US Term Limits Chair in Ohio was Bernie Moreno, who was elected last November to the US Senate representing Ohio. An Op-Ed by Kevin appeared in the Clermont Sun just after the visit by Governor DeSantis, in which Kevin makes the case for the Term Limits Convention. The timing was perfect. Kevin Coughlin has been doing a great job whipping up support for the bill, but it’s interesting that he hasn’t always been supportive of term limits. Don’t forget he spent a long time as part of the only demographic in America that isn’t enthusiastic about the idea. In a recent interview with Holly Robichaud on her YouTube program Breaking News on Term Limits, Kevin shared his conversion story.
Kevin Coughlin: I climbed on board with US Term Limits because there’s no question that Congress is broken. And I was not always a term limits fan, I have to tell you, back in… When I was in the legislature, I had all the usual arguments that you hear against it. But two things have happened. Number one, we’ve had over two decades in Ohio of experience with term limits and the world is not upside down. We’ve got some very fine leaders, things have moved forward. Ohio has continued to grow and we’ve got new blood and a churn of new blood coming in, a new set of eyes and fresh eyes coming into the legislature. The second thing that’s happened in my view is that particularly from the congressional campaign, came to the realization that, over the course of my lifetime, Congress has really been screwing up. They’ve been giving up all their power partially because they’re lazy, partially ’cause they just don’t wanna do the work to the executive branch. And they put us in this mess of indebtedness and overspending and lack of oversight over the bureaucracy. And these are the people that we believe are experienced. So I think maybe a little bit of that shock of bringing in new blood from time to time and forcing that would be a good thing for Congress.
Philip Blumel: No kidding. Thanks, Kevin. So do you live in Ohio? If you’re a regular listener, you know what to do. Go to termlimits.com/takeaction and send a message to the relevant decision makers to support the Term Limits Convention Resolution. And do it now. Let’s capitalize on the buzz in Ohio right now by showing support for congressional term limits. Thank you Governor DeSantis and thank you Ohioans for going to termlimits.com/takeaction and of course all US Term Limits supporters nationwide who have got us this far. It’s happening.
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Philip Blumel: Thanks for joining us for another episode of No Uncertain Terms. The Term Limits Convention Bills are moving through the State legislatures. This could be a breakthrough year for the Term Limits Movement. To check on the status of the Term Limits Convention Resolution in your State, go to termlimits.com/takeaction, there you will see if it has been introduced and where it stands in the committee process on its way to the floor vote. If there’s action to take, you’ll see a take action button by your State. Click it. This will give you the opportunity to send a message to the most relevant legislators urging them to support the legislation. They have to know you’re watching. That’s termlimits.com/takeaction. If your State has already passed the Term Limits Convention Resolution or the bill has not been introduced in your State, you can still help. Please consider making a contribution to US Term Limits. It is our aim to hit the reset button on the US Congress and you can help. Go to termlimits.com/donate, termlimits.com/donate. Thanks. We’ll be back next week.
Stacey Selleck: Find us on most social media at US Term Limits. Like us on Facebook, Twitter, YouTube, Instagram and now LinkedIn.
Speaker 6: USTL.